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David Hart recently became CEO of The Cannabist Company and is focused on building a strong asset base in the US cannabis market (1:35). Metrics and internal expectations, wholesale business; finding ways to improve margin profile and cash generation (11:25). Is more transparency coming? (14:45) Thoughtful ways of approaching debt (17:10). Industry rally, price drops and technical overhangs (26:40).
Rena Sherbill: David Hart, newly minted CEO of The Cannabist Company (OTCQX:CBSTF). Welcome to The Cannabis Investing Podcast. It's great to have you on the show.
David Hart: Thank you for having me.
RS: Pleasure. So catch us up on The Cannabist Company. We've talked about it a lot on this podcast in the intervening years between, kind of when the cannabis industry was starting to be talked about as Columbia Care. We had Nick Vita on the show at one point. Columbia Care was a company talked about by many analysts on the show.
And there's been a name change. You took over. Talk to us about your journey there and up until there if you'd like? And how you're thinking about things these days?
DH: Sure. So, I joined the company back in late 2016, early 2017. And, really, I joined because I've had a long standing relationship and partnership with Nick Vita, the former CEO. And when I came on board, he was looking to build out the business.
So if you rewind the clock to the 2017, 2018 timeframe, we were still very much a company that was successful at winning licenses across the country in the organic way through RFPs. And that allowed us to gain scale very quickly across the country in a number of markets. And that allowed me to be involved in the pursuit activities, preparing the RFP submissions, sometimes actually making sure we get them under the deadline.
And then ultimately, if we want to actually start to build-out to secure locations, to make sure we're hiring employees on a time -- the right time frame. We're swinging hammers from a construction perspective, all the way through getting the facilities operational, and then ultimately becoming a participant in a regulated market. And so that was a terrific experience to see sort of the soup to nuts of how you go from no business in a market all the way up to being an operational participant.
And I think we've said this before, but we probably made all the mistakes possible throughout that process. And you learn each time you go through it, whether you find the right locations, you start the construction too late, you start the hiring process too early or too late to manage expectations relative to the commercialization opportunity. And so we were very good at scaling across the country.
Fast forward to announcing the transaction with Cresco (OTCQX:CRLBF), we had grown both organically and through a couple of M&A transactions, and I think we built, which we have today, a fantastic asset base. And we entered into Cresco transaction. Fast forward through that 16 months or so, a lot happened to the industry during that time period.
And frankly, at the end of that transaction, I think it was going to be difficult to have a balance sheet for the pro forma combined company that made – that was sort of optimized. And so fast forward to August of last year, we announced that we're parting ways with Cresco, and we announced the name change. And basically, what we put in play were things that we knew we needed to do prior to the Cresco transaction.
So we went from growing this terrific asset base across the country of scale and markets that matter was clearly an attractive asset base for larger scaled companies like Cresco. And then we put things on hold. So, historically, we managed the business through sheer verticality, meaning we had operators that were responsible for cultivation through retail.
So they owned an entire market. That's a very effective management tool when you're scaling into the market for the first time. So imagine going from pursuit to operational to being a competitor. Having one person responsible for a market allows you to streamline a lot of the decision-making to effectively shorten the timelines associated with all of those very important steps to becoming an operational business.
We had identified that on a go-forward basis, you needed to actually start to compartmentalize in a way and break down the supply chain and give leaders bigger territories, but more specificity across the supply chain. And we put that on hold when we entered the Cresco transaction because they have an organizational design, they have an organizational structure, a go-to-market strategy, and we were going to move the assets into that structure.
The second thing we didn't do when we entered into the Cresco transaction was to begin to build out a dedicated infrastructure and business around our wholesale activities. So wholesale is about a 12% business for us in terms of percentage of sales. And so when we parted ways with Cresco, the two things we did -- there are three things, pretty quickly we changed the name of the company, which we can speak to, we broke apart the traditional organizational design we had in place from an operational perspective to give people more specificity across the supply chain.
And then we - frankly we started to build some infrastructure around the wholesale business. And so part of that was -- I was elevated to -- I was the COO at the time. They elevated me to President, and Jesse Channon was the Chief Revenue Officer, and he moved into Chief Commercialization Officer. Now he's the President of the company. So we set some things in motion, preparing for the opportunity to manage this asset base, that kind of was the vision that Nick had to really sweat those assets for the next couple of years as opposed to entering into a strategic transaction. So that's how we got to where we are today. So I'll pause there.
RS: I appreciate the deep dive into what's led us here because there have been a lot of moving parts and headlines. And in general, the industry has seen a lot of changes and speaking to kind of having to navigate those challenges and sometimes mistakes. Everybody in the industry has had to do so. So appreciate catching us up.
How are you looking at things going forward in terms of -- there's a lot of talk with The Cannabist about what markets you're in and how that's one of the strengths of the company. How are you thinking about that? And if you want to continue on, in terms of different parts of the company, how you're thinking about it in this year and then going forward?
DH: Sure. Great question. I think, from talking when I became the CEO, we talked to a lot of investors. We talked to analysts, other stakeholders, talked to Board members. And there are a couple of things that were clear takeaways for me. One was, we do have, to your point, we have a terrific asset base that we have built out.
We've spent a lot of CapEx over the last 3 to 4 years building out back of house cultivation, manufacturing, and premier retail locations in a lot of our markets, if not all of our markets, but certainly in a lot of markets right now that are positioned for either continued medical program growth, or in combination, adult-use conversions.
And so, if you look at 2024 and 2025 for us, I think this is the year of us looking inward at the assets we have and it's a reprioritization of what the definition of a customer is for us as a company, and the customer for us internally is for general managers and facility managers at the local level. Those are the individuals that are on the ground, making the decisions that determine the outcome of our business, frankly.
And so, whether it's the markets that are going through adult-use conversion, like in Ohio, potentially in Pennsylvania, potentially New Jersey, Delaware. We're in the middle of it right now with New Jersey. We just entered the wholesale market on the adult-use side in New York. There's talk about potential adult-use conversion in Florida.
Those are all organic opportunities, organic growth opportunities for us, and we just need to make sure that we are prepared for those as a company. And not just operationally, but as an organization, making sure that all of the shared services that surround operations are prepared to provide the support. So those local team members that are focused on their facilities and their teams can execute without distraction is what I would say.
So the internal look that we're describing is really looking at those individual assets, facilities, and teams and identifying the things we can use technology and corporate processes to take off of their plates so they can focus on customer journey on the retail side, plant health and throughput efficiency gains on the manufacturing side.
Those are all things that will allow us to, ultimately what I've heard loud and clear is, grow into the asset base that we have throughout the country. It's a premier asset base. The margin profile we have needs to approximate and move towards the other larger cap MSOs. And that's going to be possible if we actually sweat the assets, if you will.
So generate, we have capacity where we can put more plants under lights, we can get more products through manufacturing, and ultimately more people through our doors with efficiency gains. That all translates into incremental throughput, which then directly ties to the income statement from a gross margin and an absolute dollar EBITDA basis on the cash flow statement, cash flow from operations.
So those are sort of the, it's the lighthouse if you will of where we're going in 2024 and how we want to look different by the end of the year. And in combination of -- in that is the time we spent trying to close the Cresco transaction was a long time in any industry. 16 months is a long time. In the cannabis industry, that's a very long time.
And so we're going to have more town halls. We heard that loud and clear when we had a couple of town halls when I became CEO. People want to understand where we're going and why. We want to mobilize our leadership at the local level to understand where we're going and why.
And so I think just more dialogue, that's two way, between the corporate team, between the leadership team, and those in the field. That is going to help us. And it's not mutually exclusive to the, ultimately the financial goals of the company. I think they're intertwined.
It's to make sure that by the end of this year heading into 2025, we're very prepared for those organic growth opportunities, whether it's continued medical program growth, but more importantly, the adult-use conversions, that we've got the team focused, common purpose, common goal, understanding what we're trying to deliver every day to customers, customers being on the wholesale side, our counterparts, and on the retail side with our customers coming through the door.
RS: In terms of looking at the health of the company, or how you feel like it best sustains growth or surpasses targets for growth, is there a metric that you're focused on, or metrics that you're focused on specifically as CEO? And do you feel like there's a metric that you would advise investors to be focused on?
DH: It's a great question, and I think depending on the metric you look at, and you focus on, you can drive certain types of results. So, when you're planting flags and you're growing the business, one of the primary metrics I think you're evaluate on is revenue. Right? Year-over-year organic revenue growth.
I think on a go forward basis without providing guidance, because we're not going to at this point, we're talking about finding ways to improve the margin profile and cash generation of the organization. That is going to be front and center for how we view ourselves relative to our internal expectations.
So this is a year of looking for margin enhancing opportunities. It's a year for finding ways to generate incremental cash flow from operations. And everybody needs to be focused on that. Everybody who's in the field and tangential to the field needs to be focused on incremental throughput and ultimately sales generation.
Another metric that we've talked about is the wholesale business, which is around 11% or 12% of our business historically. There's certainly an opportunity to grow that as a percentage of the total business. But I think one needs to caveat that with understanding what are the longer term goals of a wholesale business for an MSO.
And so there are different revenue streams that are attached to wholesale, all of which have different margin and cash flow generating profiles. So, selling bulk flower or trim, probably the easier wholesale opportunity to go after, but generates a lower margin and consequently less cash flow.
Having a wholesale business that's migrating towards finished product on third party shelf, that has a different margin profile. It's got a better gross margin profile and ultimately a better EBITDA profile.
So to me, the things that we're focused on internally are margin improvement opportunities with the asset base we have, which translates into incremental cash flow and building a sustainable wholesale business that complements our retail footprint, which is one of the largest in the country when you exclude Florida.
And then ultimately, having a wholesale model that actually has a priority around finished product on shelf because that is a profit and cash flow enhancing business model that is frankly, I think, more sustainable over the long term as well.
So those are some of the strategic priorities that kind of translate into outcomes from a financial perspective, which -- we have a big ship, it doesn't happen overnight, but those are the medium term goals that I would say we're starting to look at from an operations and financial perspective.
RS: Appreciate that. I think especially given the strength of the states that you're talking about and the markets that you're in and the potential there, I'm curious your thoughts -- we had Jerry Derevyanny from Bengal Capital on last week, and he was talking about, he would love to see companies release state by state numbers.
Do you have any thoughts there on in terms of numbers that might be coming up in the industry or how you're thinking about that in terms of the relationship to shareholders and investors?
DH: Sure. Great question. Just had a conversation with an investor who was asking similar types of questions, and I think it's top of mind for everybody in the industry and those that are following because I think people want to have a better understanding of what has been built, what is the capacity potential for the assets you have. And ultimately, how does that translate into the potential for incremental growth, but ultimately to be judged on market share gains and profitability trade-offs for market share gains.
And so I think you're going to see – so, what I would say is, I would probably be more conservative in terms of the type of incremental disclosures we would provide on a state by state basis. And I only say that because I firmly believe that if you start to disclose a new metric, give it - pick one, a revenue number or a profitability profile for a specific state or very specific canopy numbers around a specific state, I think you need to be prepared in the public markets. Once you disclose a number, I just remember being on the buy side, once a metric is disclosed, I'm going to ask for that metric every quarter.
And so I think we would want to be well positioned on any incremental disclosure to recognize that we will have the responsibility to provide that measure every quarter on an ongoing basis until it becomes perhaps less relevant as a percentage or material nature.
But I do think we're going to move in that direction. Part of it might actually come from the incremental disclosures that I think you'll continue to see from regulators in the market. So there's ways to start to triangulate around performance from individual operators, but I do think you're going to see more transparency, not less.
RS: Appreciate that. In terms of debt, I mean we’ve seen a bit about how you're thinking about debt in terms of The Cannabist Company.
How are you as a general cohesive executive team, Board, thinking about debt and your approach to it as we move on through the years? And maybe catalysts come, maybe they don’t. Who knows? But how are you thinking about that going forward?
DH: I think we want to be thoughtful about managing the debt load relative to the cash generation of this business. We announced an equity offering late last year. We announced a debt for equity exchange earlier this year. So I think you’re going to continue to see us find ways to appropriately de-lever the business. This would be a raise the bridge, lower the water analysis, if you will.
We want to continue to drive incremental EBITDA and cash flow from the assets we have because it’s there for us to get. But also be thoughtful about the trade-off between managing the debt profiles of which I think is very well known.
We’ve got a May maturity coming up, and then we’ve got 2025s and 2026s. So we want to be thoughtful about those, and we’ve got – we have relationships, a number of institutional relationships with the 2025s and 2026s. We’ve got good working relationships. But I think we want to be thoughtful about dilution, as everybody should be. And this is probably the same debate a lot of executive teams are having.
To your point, you mentioned if and when something happens at the federal level, I think you have to manage the business with the expectations that you don’t know, and so you plan accordingly, and that’s what we’re doing. If we do get something, and that would be a win for the entire industry, we would benefit arguably perhaps a bit more than others, given our retail heavy focus right now. So that would be a welcomed win for the industry and for us as a company.
But I think we want to be responsible stewards of the capital. We recognize that you want to avoid dilution when you can, and you want to be thoughtful and responsible about the debt level relative to the performance of the business. So I think it’s an ongoing conversation.
Honestly, I think probably every Board and executive team in the industry is having frequent dialogue as a team to understand what are the optimal metrics for the business over the next 24 months and how to manage that accordingly. And we’re no different.
RS: Yeah. It’s ever evolving, this industry of ours. And so many different parts that are ever evolving. In terms of ever evolving and catalyst coming, how are you thinking about 280E and the general thought about catalyst coming? Do you, I mean, you mentioned that you’re planning for the status quo, but is there a certain catalyst that you feel like might come first or that excites you more than others?
And then as an addendum to that question, do you have any – although it might be completely separate, do you have any thoughts on companies not paying taxes?
DH: Sure. So I think the potential for 280E to fall away seems to be more likely than it ever has been. Having said that, we don’t have it yet, so I don’t think you can plan for it. We’re trying to manage the business as if that’s not going to come.
And when it does, that would be a welcome relief. I’ve tried to organize the leadership team around things we can control because I think that’s the best use of the management team’s time. And right now, what we can control is the planning around the growth opportunities for adult-use in the markets we talked about earlier.
Being prepared to paddle out to capture those waves when they come in is mission-critical for us. It sets the tone for your trajectory in the adult-use markets that are converting. You’re paddling out to be prepared to put products on shelf with dispensaries as they prepare for adult-use. You need to prepare your retail team for the incremental volume that’s likely to come through.
Those are the things that we can arguably control and should be held accountable to in terms of the outcomes for those. And that’s the priority for the organization right now. There are other markets – every market is different, right?
So I’m going to avoid giving the generic reference at every market. It depends on which market you’re looking at. But we have markets like Colorado that have gone through a turnaround, not only as an industry, but as company for us. We’ve invested a lot of time, money, and energy, and that team has done a remarkable job to prepare us for the go forward Colorado market, which is down from the $2.2 billion, or $2.3 billion market it was. It’s probably a $1.6 billion, $1.7 billion. I haven’t seen the final print from 2023. But we’re a major player in that market, and it’s a very large market.
And there’s no reason why we can’t continue to find ways to take incremental market share and have a different business in Colorado in mid-2025 than we do today. That’s there for us to execute against and to take. So those are the priorities that the team is focused on.
As it relates to taxes, we’ve disclosed where we were as of the end of Q3. What I would say is, we haven’t taken the approach of others, some of the larger MSOs that have simply stopped entirely.
We’re managing our tax payable in a way that I think is responsible and is putting us in a position that to the extent we get 280 relief, we have a welcome outcome, but we also have a manageable relationship with the IRS on a go forward basis, in the event it doesn’t come in 2024, or 2025. I think that’s what we have disclosed publicly, and that’s the go forward strategy for us.
But again, 280E relief would be a welcomed relief, and I think we’ve never been closer, but we are not there yet. So my crystal ball is no better than yours, or anybody else’s, I think. But I wouldn’t even want to speculate on the timing of that.
I just know that we seem to be a lot closer than we ever have been, particularly what’s happened between the FDA submission and the DEA’s formal review process. So it’s encouraging, but like you said, this is an industry that let’s just see what actually happens in the timing and plan for the conservative outcome. And if we get something else, that’s a welcome relief.
RS: Yeah. Speaking to Colorado, in terms of these markets that, as you mentioned, have seen growth and are now declining, how do you manage through that and build for that in terms of the price of cannabis falling and how that affects things? How do you keep navigating through that?
DH: We’ve learned a lot in Colorado. We were there. We were the first non-Colorado organization to have operations. We were the first to make an acquisition out there. We’ve learned that price decline curves can be steep. They can be dramatic, and you need to prepare for scenarios where that could potentially occur.
Colorado has shown stability over the last quarter or two, and we’ve certainly seen some stability in the market, which is encouraging. We’ve seen price points actually kind of tick-off from the bottom, which is helpful. I would say it’s green shoots, nothing more, but it is helpful. But I think we always take a step back and think about it big picture as an organization.
We’re a major player in Colorado. It’s still a $1.6 billion market. It’s one of the biggest in the country. It’s highly fragmented, and there is opportunities for incremental market share gains both on the retail side and on the wholesale side with a more disciplined approach to wholesale. And that will change the profile of our company in Colorado, which will have a disproportionate impact on our overall business just given the size of our business in Colorado relative to the total portfolio. It is material.
But I think the lessons learned are very important for what could potentially happen in any market that’s going through an adult-use conversion, depending on the competitive framework that exists heading into adult-use, the number of new stores, the number of new cultivation and manufacturing locations that are going to open up.
I think you need to be very disciplined in your inventory management. That’s a lesson learned that we’ve experienced firsthand. You need to time – so to double back to the question you asked earlier about what we can focus on internally, it’s about getting the timing right without being too conservative or too aggressive in planning for that adult-use market to come.
A lot of what we produce obviously has an expiration date. And so, you need to be thoughtful about how you scale up your cultivation and manufacturing to meet that opportunity to paddle out for that wave to catch it. And if you don’t do that right, there are consequences.
You have margin implications. You’ve got quality implications in terms of consumers’ perception of your brands. Many consumers are first to market in the adult-use conversion. So their experience, the first time they interact with your product, your brands, your dispensaries, that’s important.
But we have learned that price decline curves can be severe and significant, and you need to be a scaled operator in a market to participate in those sort of draconian type of price decline curves, which frankly, they haven’t necessarily presented themselves in the East Coast like they have in Colorado, but it doesn’t mean they can’t. And you have to be scaled, and I don’t think you can be all things to everybody. It’s a lesson we’ve learned in Colorado as well.
So you don’t need to make and be a top 2 or 3 player in every product category. You have to pick where you have scale and you can be efficient and drive margins that are appropriate for your business. You can’t be an end-all be-all for everybody. You won’t be able to get to scale in SKU categories. Someone else will, and you have to be prepared for that.
RS: I think a big theme in general and certainly of this conversation is being prepared for the unknown, while managing what’s right in front of you. And we’ve seen some rallying in cannabis stocks lately with talk from DEA and rescheduling et all.
And we saw some price drops along with that. There was talk of the hedge fund Traynor liquidating. There was talk of (MJ), (MJUS) rebalancing. How do you manage through that and anything that you care to share in terms of kind of those headlines or what’s behind them?
DH: Sure. All those things you’ve mentioned have been arguably probably defined as technical overhang for our stock. I would put those in the category of things I wish I could help influence the outcome of, but I can’t.
Those are one off things that unfortunately had the impact of us underperforming relative to other MSOs since a point in time last year. I think that’s a technical consideration. I’m not going to speculate on stock performance certainly, but I do think those were technical overhangs that have been – arguably are behind us, maybe even definitively.
So I think, again, we’re trying to control what we can, which is at the end of the day, if we can deliver by the end of this year a business that looks different financially, improved margins, improved cash flow generation, I think you get rewarded for that as a shareholder, and the technical considerations will come and go.
You said it earlier, this is a wild and crazy industry, there’s no question. Same thing goes for stock performance and the volatility is at times, I think you could use the word breathtaking on a daily, weekly, monthly basis. But my message to the team is, let’s control what we can control. Let’s deliver outcomes that we know we can actually deliver on. And ultimately, valuation comes back to mean something over time.
And I think there’s strategic asset valuations that you can look at, look at the markets we’re in and the values of those licenses and the embedded optionality of what’s coming. That’s one way to look at the business. I mean, that you could probably triangulate around valuation a few different ways, but ultimately, performance is what’s going to drive shareholder value over time.
And I think that’s what we need to focus on as a team. It just happens to be, we’ve had some pretty significant technical overhangs that the market was aware of that have now been resolved. So hopefully, knock on wood, those are behind us and new ones are not going to present themselves.
RS: And do you have anything to say about there was talk from shareholders about Nick Vita selling some shares. Anything to say there?
DH: No. I mean, he’s still a large shareholder, and I think you have to delineate between his transactions, which are personal. They’re his decisions, some of which have been stock sales, some of which have been donations to entities. So I think, ultimately, it’s Nick’s decision and determination what he wants to do with the stock, but he’s still a big shareholder of the company, and he’s on the Board.
So, he still has a vested interest in seeing us perform. And frankly, he’s a resource for the organization. He has more battle scars than anybody. I think he may have even – I think he was calling us a multistate operator before people even kind of recognized what that phrase meant strangely. So nothing to comment other than – he remains a large shareholder even after the selling that has taken place.
RS: And any thoughts – when I talked to Nick, which was a while ago, there was talk about the international picture. Do you have thoughts on the international picture and how you’re approaching that or not approaching that?
DH: Yes. So we are right now 100% focused on the United States as a company. We, over the last year and a half, two years, we’ve exited a number of initiatives that we had previously been evaluating and spending some capital on, one of which was European options.
So, we’re no longer involved in anything outside of the United States. We’re no longer in Puerto Rico. We no longer engage in a CBD line. So, we are very focused on the assets we have, where we have licenses, where we can drive value. So that has been a simplification of our go to market strategy, which is just focusing on the United States.
RS: Very good. Is that – was that kind of a long conversation, or were you all pretty clear, or were you pretty clear on how your approach was to the international picture?
DH: I think if you rewind the clock, all three of those that I just mentioned were probably associated with the first stages of evolution of the company around planting flags and looking for optionality to see what could potentially happen.
And when we sort of did a review of those, we determined that the strategic narrative around those opportunities were more than offset by the potential length of commercialization and the expense and the capital that would have to be deployed to ultimately be around for the realization.
And it just didn’t stack up relative to, if you think about a dollar to invest, a dollar to invest in Europe versus a dollar to invest in building out a third dispensary in New Jersey, or incremental canopy for the New Jersey adult-use conversion, It just became a prioritization list, right? And those things just fell to the bottom. And when you add in the time, money and energy for the team to focus on one more thing, it didn’t make the cut ultimately. So we were aligned when we went to the evaluation.
RS: I’m also curious if you have any thoughts on how you think about being included in the ETF (MSOS) and in general, the fact that that’s used as a proxy for the industry. And there’s some question about how they’re allocating and when they’re allocating and how much they are allocating? How would you articulate thoughts about that to investors?
DH: Sure. I think there’s complications around getting exposure to the U.S. plant touching business, which is how all of this has evolved. And I think over time, if we can get to a more normalized U.S. capital markets environment where people can make direct – can more easily make direct bets on underlying businesses and management teams, I think you reduce the complexity.
The way they index, the way they transact around the ETF, I would put it in the bucket of things that I just can’t control in the immediate term, and doesn’t determine the outcome of our business. I think that complexity starts to fall away and people can make more traditional standardized bets on individual companies when it’s easier for U.S. investors to actually own our stock, and not be worried about potential calls from brokers about holdings.
RS: What has you most concerned as a CEO? Is it company specific? Is it sector specific? Is it kind of broad – kind of macro specific?
DH: I would first say that coming from the COO role, I get the opportunity to say, I’m looking inward because I think I can bring that perspective to the company, and I think it’s needed.
RS: Good answer.
DH: The things that keep me up at night is building the right culture for the organization with the reprioritization of, as I mentioned earlier in our discussion, facility managers and general managers probably have the hardest jobs in our company. They’re incredibly stressful. You’re dealing with not only customer journey, inventory management, potentially regulated product buys, online menu syncing, third-party vendor management, employee-related matters, high transaction volumes at times.
That’s an incredibly complex job, and I think it goes underappreciated in the industry. And if I can be the champion to say these are the jobs that deliver the most value for us as an organization, I think that’s a win for the company and for the industry. So that would be my number one priority.
It's looking inward and finding ways to make those individuals as free as possible to focus on what they can do at the hyperlocal level that frankly we can’t do remotely, that can add value to the customer journey and to plant health. If we can do that, I think that actually is the best way for us to see a translation into the financial gains as a company. So that is -- that's what I lose sleep over, which is how do we get the message out in a way that doesn't take three quarters or four quarters, but also comes across as authentic and transparent about where we're going and why.
That's what I'm hyper-focused on in immediate term. I've had a number of calls, probably 20 at this point with executives throughout the organization, just hearing their perspective because they have a perspective that I simply don't have, understanding what they would focus on. I've asked questions such as, what are you afraid I might change? What do you think we should change? What do you think our customers want? What's the one thing we're doing right now that we just shouldn't do?
These are kind of sort of open-ended questions that I've been engaging with employees throughout the organization, and frankly, I'll continue to do to just understand how we can do things better.
This is an industry which is incredibly fascinating because it's not often where you get to work for a business that covers cultivation through manufacturing, distribution, and retail, and brand development, all under one umbrella. You could have a death by a 1000 cuts by trying to focus on everything and not the 1, 2, 3, or 4 things that create the value and the spark throughout the organization to get people unified around a common goal and purpose.
That's what I feel like my mandate is right now, to make sure that we're standalone business on a go forward basis. Where are we going and why, and what does each team member do, what are they contributing to that ultimate end goal.
Not only just financially, but how what they're doing. How is that impacting people in the field and making their lives easier. We need to do a better job of communicating that. So that takes up all my time basically. That's what I’m hyper-focused on.
RS: I like that answer very much. That's a very thoughtful answer. And one of my favorite things is thoughtful leadership. I benefit greatly from that here at Seeking Alpha, and I really, really appreciate you coming on and sharing with such depth and nuance and explanation. And you let me ask every question.
I really appreciate you coming on, David, and sharing with our listeners, sharing with investors. It's a murky picture out there, and there's so much to navigate and especially as retail investors. So thanks for shining some light on a murky picture and sharing with us so much knowledge and information from the inside. So -- and I appreciate that, number one. And number two, anything that you'd care to leave listeners with or feel like we haven't mentioned, feel free to do so.
DH: Well, first, thank you for the opportunity. This has been terrific. I love the platform. I love what you guys do. I think it's terrific. Finding ways to interact with retail investors, I think we need to do a better job of that as an industry and as our leadership team. So thank you for that. And the only thing I would say is, I'm excited to show what we're capable of doing with the assets we have and looking forward to our next conversation.
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